Episode 97

Hello and welcome to the Art of Raising Humans. I'm Kyle and I'm Sara and today we're gonna talk about stop Stop saying stop right? Right. Yeah, stop it. Stop you stop it. No, you stop it. You tell me to stop it. Yeah, stop it. Do it Stop that. I mean all too often Sara This is a go -to, right? Hear it all the time from parents and kids. It is kind of like, I don't know, it seems like, well, I've coached parents throughout the world, Sara. I remember coaching a couple in Switzerland, another couple in like Germany, and even when I was coaching, their go -to was stop. And I was like, this is interesting. This isn't just an American thing. Worldwide, universal parenting strategy. And I'm thinking like, Why do we say that so often? Why do we say stop? Because they need to stop it. I it seems like it's the go to if some conflicts happening at school and I'm talking to a kid, hey, did you tell your parents about that conflict? Yes. What did they tell you to do? Tell that kid to stop it. And I know even for us, sometimes you can feel your brain go there. Just stop it. It's so annoying. Yeah. You know, and so I think we say it so often because culturally, I guess even throughout the world globally, we hear that a lot. We're constantly wanting people to stop doing things and it's easy just to say real quick, stop that. Okay. Um, our brain defaults to that. Yeah, but I also anything uncomfortable. I think it's bigger than that too. Yeah. I think it's bigger than that too. It's also, we model, we model this, like whether we say it or not, we model it as parents. that when things that I don't like are happening, I may not even say stop it particularly, like you used to use the word quit it, but I will resist it and I want it to go away. Yeah. You know, so I think because we model that as parents in our lives, like, you know, I like to drive a little faster than you do, or I can be a little more impatient when it comes to driving. So like even how I model it, how I'm waiting in a line. I remember one time waiting in a fast food line just because it was taking so long. I'm like, what is going on? Why is this taking so long? You know, and really in so many words, I'm saying, stop doing this, you know, change this thing. You know, I think anytime. We're uncomfortable. We want it to stop. So if you're in pain, you know, it's like you there's a piece of this thing. Stop it. Stop hurting. you know, in the line that you're in, whatever it is, when something's uncomfortable, if your kids are arguing, it's uncomfortable. And your brain says, stop this. Yes, that's good. I like that. That's true. And so then we learn to get into this way of doing almost everything in life. So, so we are going to talk specific about how to change this particular way of, let's move away. More successful. Yes. Yes. Move away from saying, stop it. Let's do something. But there's also a deeper thing here. that I think we need to address first before we get into those specifics. And that deeper thing in so many families, and I know including ours as well, way before we changed our parenting, but even at times we can get into this too, is we start to believe that if we resist, change will happen. So we resist what is in hopes of changing it and making something better. Yeah. Okay. Our first reaction to something uncomfortable and we don't want. is to sort of push back against it. So I don't like this, so I push against it, push against it, which is that resistance. We're thinking just like a block on the floor piece of furniture, I can just shove it back and move it out of the way. This thing I don't want, I resist it. For people not watching the video, it looks like you're using the force. I love that we resist it. But really what we know through science, through psychology, through our study, working with parents and coaching them, is it's exciting. Acceptance that changes. Yeah the moment it's not resisting the moment and and and so I want to dive into that just a little bit because I think it's really important you've got to understand that Because I think lots of times we think we can change ourselves by telling ourselves to stop it Yeah, you know so many parents come to us for coaching help because they want to stop yelling Yeah, right and that's great. You know, so they'll say I want to stop yelling They want to stop eating bad food So they go get on a diet or go start trying to find how to not eat bad food They want to stop being so lazy, you know, they want to stop drinking so much So anytime they're trying to change those habits they think about stopping the bad habit I think even a big one to mention is anxiety or fear. Yeah you know, actually if you're having anxiety or fear if you've ever dealt with that. We want to push against it. We want to say stop. We want to tell ourselves stop, stop, stop. But if you've worked with anxiety and stuff, it's actually sort of the acceptance of that feeling, that flow. When you do that, then you can actually start directing it and doing something about it. Well, and I want to give some specific examples. I'm sure every listener, listener right now is going, oh yeah, this happens in my house a lot. But I know specific examples we hear a lot. We just were brainstorming. And if you can't think of what we're talking about, listeners, here's what we're talking about. So a good example is siblings. You hear the siblings say, stop doing that. Stop. I know in our house it's stop singing. Stop singing. Stop making that noise. Stop bouncing that ball. Stop playing with toys. You know, are my toys, right? Or stop eating with your mouth open. Stop clicking, tapping, drumming. Oh my gosh. Clicking the pin. That's right. It's a real click, click, click. Stop clicking. You know? The eating with your mouth open is never happy. That never happens. All the kids eat with their mouth closed. All the time. Yes, I wish that was true, but it's not. So I know if I hear the clicking of the pin or you hear the tapping, some annoying noise, you know, your first inclination is stop. Or the same song sung for the 50th times. Do you have a singer in your home listeners? We'd love your feedback. I love singing. The 50th. Yes. And then parents telling the kids to stop playing the video games. Stop whining. Yeah, stop fighting. Right? So there's all this stop language there conflict with kids at school Like I said, the typical parents typical answer is tell that kid to leave you alone and stop it Right, and then I'll hear from the kid, you know One of the reasons why I thought we should do a podcast and this is I'll hear from the kid I'll say did that work? No, okay So what did the kid do and this is what happens a lot Sara when I'm talking to kids What did the kid do when you just stop he did it more? He did it more? What? That's a surprise, you know? But it's not a surprise because when the kid hears you say stop it and the kid sees you getting all energized about it, the kid's like, cool. I know that's a button. I can continue. And not always even conscious. Yes. Yeah. And even for little kids, it's maybe it's your re it can be your reaction for sure. It can be, whoa, what that, you know, two year old or something. I'm like, wow, that. Wow, look what that did. I was just driving this little car and banging it into something. Look at that reaction. Or I'm pushing these buttons and look at that. Cause two year olds, you know, their brains are kind of wired for looking for reactions cause they're in that stage of what happens if you do this. Cause and effect. And then that happens and you do that. But sometimes can I get into the, what happens in our brain with the nose in the stoppits? Of course. Yes. Go ahead. So sometimes he has this order of things. So I'm trying to stick with a now order, but. our brains especially when we say stop eating ice cream every night. Our brain focuses on the ice cream every night. If you say, don't push that button, I'm thinking about ice cream right now. Thanks. Right. So just, you can obviously try that. Maybe, maybe I've heard this one before. If you say, don't think about white elephants, don't think about white elephants. Don't think about white elephants. What are you thinking about a white elephant or a purple balloon or whatever it might be. So those words stop, no, don't in our brain, they don't register those super well. They hear the other parts. I don't hear the negatives. They hear the other. thing going on. So with our children, with ourselves, we're focusing on don't eat that, don't do that. Our brain focuses more on the thing you're wanting to stop. It doesn't focus less on it. Like stop eating sugar. The kids are like, oh, what sugar can I not have now? Or in school a lot as teachers say, stop running, stop yelling. Yes, that one you hear a lot. So then kids, their brains, even though they know you mean stop. but their brain will actually be more focused on the word running. not on the stop running or don't run. So right before you said that, the sentence I had written down was telling a kid to stop, to stop it just gets them focused on the very thing we don't want them to do. So you've shifted all the focus towards that and it's actually going to take, it's going to take more effort for the kid to not do the thing you want them to do. Because their brain even, it's like, and I hope in this, I hope you can see how this is going to help. you as a listener too. If you're trying to eat better, you know, we'll get to that in just a second. If you're thinking about all the things you should stop eating, it's gonna make it exponentially more difficult. Don't yell, don't be mad, don't worry, don't be anxious. If you're telling yourself, like, if you feel those feelings and you're trying to just smush them, don't do that, don't feel that, don't feel that. I mean, I would think you would know that never really works. It's not very successful. For a moment it is, but then you almost are worse afterwards. Well, you know, when I'm helping parents and coaching them, Sara, specifically dads, I would never say, hey, here's a great way to stop yelling. Just in the moment when things are heated, just tell yourself, don't yell. That wouldn't be great advice. It wouldn't be helpful to the person, right? Because now they're focused the whole time. Don't yell. Don't yell. Don't yell. But they're like, what am I supposed to do? Well, just don't yell. Well, that's not success. Success is doing something better, you know, eating something different. So here's the big idea. Change doesn't happen through resistance. Change happens through acceptance. You need to focus on what you want somebody to do instead of what you want them to stop doing. Yes. Right. And that's kind of what you're getting at with the brain. I've got to shift. Wear my, almost like I saw Dr. Becky Bailey do this at a conference one time when she took a flashlight and it's like wherever my flashlight is gonna be, that's where we're all gonna look, right? So think about it, anytime you're trying to help a kid, act like you have a flashlight, you have one of those helmets, I think Becky actually wore a helmet with a light on top, and it was like wherever, that's where the light's gonna go, you know? And if you're in the dark, why would you be looking at, you'd be looking where the light's going, and the kid is gonna follow the light. So if I'm saying, don't go there, don't go there, don't go there, the kids are like, well, where do we go? That seems to be the place you shine in. reminds me, have you ever gone up and you're like, okay, don't look now, but so and so. And what does everybody do? They look, right? So it'd be much better to be like, hey everyone, look over there. so and so is right behind us. Right? Because then you would have so much better as soon as you say don't look now everyone. Yes. Yeah. Well, so we we kind of narrowed it down to four specific ways to approach these moments different and I'm telling this seems like Oh, what's the big deal? Same stuff. It is revolutionary in your family. When you can now see every moment as a moment. to accept the moment as it is and then actually change it. That's what I hope listeners are hearing. When you're saying stop it, you're resisting the moment and you actually make the moment more likely to happen in the future. Yeah. Can I give my river example? Yeah, go ahead. So I was telling him, it kind of reminds me of a flowing water. It could be down your driveway or a little stream or something. And I remember as kids, we would play in little streams and things all the time. And if you build a dam, the water just builds up and builds up and builds up and it doesn't really, right. That doesn't really work. So instead, if I want to change the river, I knew much better to just guide it a different direction. We would build little walls or you pull little sticks somewhere and you're instead the water is flowing. You know, in our case, you couldn't shut it off. I could try to build dams. I stopped water, but the water just starts pouring everywhere. It still goes. Instead I needed to direct the water where I want it to go. Yeah. I love it. And then I'm thinking what you're accepting there is that the river is going to flow. You're not going to stop the And it's going to go downhill, right? It's not typically going to go uphill, right? So it's going to go downhill. So I want to make sure I'm focused on where I want the water to go rather than stopping it from going where it is. Yeah. And so in the same way, think of the kids energy as a river and you're going to guide that. Like I want to get into these fours. specific ones and maybe it will sum it up but as you're sharing your river example too I'm thinking about the time we were at that birthday party and this little kid he was a kid of a friend of ours their kid and he had a baseball bat it was like a plastic baseball bat he's maybe four or five years old he comes over and he starts hitting my leg with the baseball bat and immediately I saw the shock and horror on the parents face and like, stop hitting him, right? And then knowing what we know, I was thinking, I don't think he wants to hit me. I think he's saying, what do I do with this baseball bat? This is really fun to swing. Yeah. So I just said, Hey, is there a ball? Do you have a ball for him? So he throws me the ball that goes with the bat and I say, Hey, take this ball, go outside, hit it. And the kid was like, thanks. I just like did it. Like that's where I think so many times this stop it thing is. What we don't understand we're doing is by resisting the kid and saying, stop it. We're teaching them to do that with their siblings. We're also teaching them to resist their other people. They're even themselves too. Resist themselves as well. And they're just getting really, really skilled at being resistant. Whereas instead, if you're wanting a kid to be more cooperative, you're wanting a kid to flow where you're wanting them to flow, by doing that, you have to be accepting of what the... the energy is the kid has and then go guide it to a different place. Right? Okay. So the number one notice. So first of all, you got to slow it down. All change happens with awareness. So number one, notice when you're wanting to say stop. Okay. And the reason why you want to notice that Sara is because you are resisting the moment. So why is noticing important? Well, I think you kind of covered it. Did I? What would you add? Well, like you said, you got to slow down. because there's that piece of awareness that's really important. It's not a bad thing that you want something to stop, right? But if we can just slow ourselves down a little bit and go, what's happening here? What is this child? Doing what am I feeling and then and then I can be intentional about changing the direction of that little river I and I can be thinking about where I'm wanting it to go instead of just resisting it It'll change the whole dynamic of our relationship and what's going on inside of me. Yeah, it's great And then number two, so once you've noticed then now pause Think about what you want them to do. Okay? So where are you wanting them to go? Now this is different than the other one where you're resisting the moment. Now you are accepting the moment and you're trying, I mean, this is, I think this is probably the hardest one, is to go, wait, what does I actually want them to do? Right. Cause obviously if there's something like they're arguing and you're saying, stop arguing. We are like, how do I, where can they argue? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But you're, you're because hopefully you've kind of become aware of what's going on and then you're going to guide that need or that want, or you're, you're going to now be intentional about where. It's easy with something like a kid hitting a bat, maybe. You can think, OK, where can this child go hit the bat? What could they hit with instead of hitting me? But with the argument, you're thinking, OK, we've got to resolve this, right? Instead of just arguing, I want to help guide them into a conflict resolution situation. I want to help them learn how to talk to each other. So your focus there is you want them both to hear each other and then pursue a resolution. Because that's really the whole reason why they're they're arguing is they both want to be heard and each other if you notice they're not listening to each other they're not really hearing each other you know and they're both resisting exactly they're both focused on resisting the other person's perspective and if you come in with your resistance well and then what that happens lots of then the parent does and they think it's solved the problem but it's solved nothing right all I did was tell the kids okay we got to like next time be quieter when we're arguing so they don't jump in or the biggest person wins so whoever has the biggest power they resist the moment they win So someday when I'm a big teenager, I can resist mom or dad and maybe I can yeah So so we want to pause think about what you want them to do That's that's a big shift and this is gonna be huge when you're teaching siblings as well You're gonna want them to notice right and then pause and think about what is it? Your sibling is actually trying to accomplish here. How can they do so the third step is? Consider the other person's needs and wants in the moment. Yeah, what does that mean? Yeah, that's being aware of So in that situation. We kind of touched on this. So if I see my child is hitting everything in the house, then I would think, Oh, my two year old has a lot of energy and they want to hit things and I can take them outside and they can hit a ball. They can hit rocks. They can hit all kinds of things and have somewhere to put all that excitement energy around hitting. Right. That's safe and okay for everybody involved if they're arguing, you know, so it's, it's that pausing in that awareness of what do they need? Step into their shoes. Yes. That's part of the empathy. It's not really showing empathy. and trying to like get it from their perspective. So it's not a oh this what's wrong with this kid who's hitting stuff. Oh maybe has a lot of energy and it could be stress from his day it could be all kinds of different things it could just be curious but either way if that's okay I can just assist him in how to do that. So in the argument thing that's that one's a little more nuanced. I like that example. because then you're sitting there thinking, what does this person need and what does that person need? So it is that empathy. It is that stepping into their shoes, kind of without the judgment, withhold the judgment and just look at it from their perspective in their eyes. Maybe one of them is needing attention. So they're kind of nitpicking at the other sibling and they're bored or they just want to hang out with that person. And this is the best they can do right now. Maybe the person is tired and wants to just read. I'm just making this up, but, but, but stepping into their shoes to go, what are your needs and wants? What are your needs and wants? Well, I'm thinking as you just said you're making this up I'm thinking of even bedtime could be like this, you know, the parent wants to leave I know this was a constant. So I wanted to say good night I wanted to leave and go do my own thing hang out with you whatever right and the kid didn't want you to leave the kid wants So it's like how can we do that? Yes, well and even what I realize Is the kids also thinking you're gonna go have some fun without me. I like hanging out with mom, too And so I'm like just accept it right and so that I want I hope listeners get they're like I'm wanting the kid to just accept the reality that it's time for bed but then I'm not accepting the reality that that's hard for them to do that and to not be able to participate in that or it's hard for them to be in a loan in a dark room with all of their anxious thoughts or whatever might be from the day you know and so once I accept that then I can say hey would this help right? And then I do that and then, oh yeah. And then, then you could go off and go do your thing, dad. But I'd love for you to lay there for a minute. Right. So then I'm going to, I'm going to lay here for 10 more minutes. Right. And I'm just going to sing with you or I'm going to read with you or whatever it is to help relax you. Or let's listen to a meditation together. Let's listen to something that can help you relax. So there I'm stepping into their shoes, helping them be able to accept that eventually I am leaving, but I'm also trying to give you the tools and the skills. And you're accepting where they're at. Yes. This is hard. This isn't. Instead of being like, no, my mind Sara like why is it taking you so long to just accept the fact that I'm not gonna be here all night with you you know let's just move on grow up you know those are the kind of thoughts you have you know and and what you find is sometimes I'll meet with kids who are still struggling with this into their teenage years because that thought was they just need to grow up and get over it and they've just never learned the skill to do it you know they're resisting sleep the parents resisting the fact that the kid doesn't want to go to sleep and it's just they're getting you know more more skilled so it's kind of moving into if you listen to our other podcast about win -wins yeah but this is moving into that skill of a win -win. I'm stepping into their shoes and I'm valuing their needs and wants, my needs and wants, whoever's involved, all of those are on the table and value, and I'm looking for a win for all of us in that situation. So the last, the four. So number one is notice when you're wanting to say stop, you don't want to resist the moment. Two, pause, think about what you want them to do, start accepting the moment. Number three, consider the other person's needs and wants in the moment. Take a moment to really have empathy, try to step into their shoes. Number four, give them clear direction on how to get what they want, right? Yeah. The example I have there is helping a teenager one time, Sara, and was coaching him through this. And his little brother was annoying the snot out of him. He's like, man, I was like, well, what's happening? He said, well, I'll be watching a show on Netflix. And then my little brother will come up, and he'll start shooting me with a Nerf gun. And I said, what do you do then? I go chase after him, and I catch him, and I beat him up. OK, OK. OK, I can see why you would do that. I guess that is annoying. Do you think your little brother wanted you to track him down to be noise? No, probably not. He actually doesn't seem to like it when I do it. That's why I do it to try to get him to stop doing that, right? And like, okay, what do you think he actually wants? And most kids actually know this answer. He's like, I think he just wants to play with. Oh, okay. So what if you tried this? So just next time you're watching the Netflix show brother comes up has the Nerf gun. Just look at him and say, Hey, if you want to play with me, this show's going to be over in about 20 minutes. I can play with you then we can do Nerf guns then. And it was awesome. The kid came back the next time. Say, Hey, I tried what you said. And my little brother said, Oh, cool. And he just like left. And he said the problem solved. Cause really all he did was say like, he gave him clear direction on how to get what he wanted. And therefore the kid. felt understood and heard and no longer needed to resist what his brother was doing. So with the whining that makes me think of the whining. Yes. You might say stop whining. You know and and then instead of resisting that I there's lots of options but you could say wow I hear in your voice that you're... Worried about this or you know what you know kind of empathize and connect with them and then you can say you know What if you're wanting something this is how you can tell me and then you just practice with them You know and let them rehearse and go Wow. Yeah, I can hear you Because really what whining is is them just thinking their voice has no power And then once you teach them how to say it then they go. Oh my voice is that power Yeah, I don't need to want him. I can clearly state what I want. Yep, and it needs from the parent. You can't ignore them Because if you're wanting to build that skill, you need to give it attention. So then you can notice, oh, I heard you say that you very clearly and look how strong your voice is and you can make comments about it. And they know that they're heard. It doesn't mean you do what they always say. Cause then again, you might say, well, we can have a cookie right now, but you know what? After dinner, that would work. When you know it, what, what's so interesting about whining and that topic is the reason why I think it upsets parents so much is the whining looks, it's just weakness. It's helplessness. and most of us don't like that within ourselves. And so when we see it in the kid, we wanna resist that, you know? And so that's why we want that to go away, because it feels all weak and helpless and gross, you know? And we want them just to be it's just kind of irritating. I think that's what I hear from, might just be me, I don't know, but I think that's it's like. It's like, oh, that's so gross. Okay, so in wrapping up is basically you're wanting to point them to something rather than pushing them away. Okay. You're guiding yourself. That's the biggest point. The biggest point is instead of going like this and pushing away, pushing the behavior away, you want to just shift it. And it's like turning it. It's like steering that little water. The water is going to flow. So instead I'm going to steer it where I want it to go. So I'm going to steer my child into a way that's successful for me. And then, and we can. Yeah, and so to wrap that up is you're gonna guide yourself and them towards what you are wanting rather than what you are not wanting. Yes. It sounds easy. I'm telling you, it's very difficult. Yeah, and when you're not used to it, I remember the first time I heard this I thought, what? How do I do that? I know. And, but then I saw it was almost magical. I have kids who wouldn't want to leave. I mean, throw, throw down, drag out, did not want to leave. Cause a great time playing with you and engaging you. And they would not want to leave. And they were maybe even going back to school or something. And there was such big resistance. It would take 20 minutes or some big deal. And I learned to, instead of just saying, you've got to stop playing. It's time to go. Instead I would just help shift them into the next thing. I'd help shift their mind. I didn't. even address the fact that they didn't want to leave. I just helped move them into that next space they were going to. Well and you could see it happen because I've had that happen with kids too and you see the parent getting more and more anxious and more and more frustrated and you see the kids the kid just becomes more and more resistant and you can see it. You know I remember even being at Chick -fil -A one time and a parent was getting really mad that a kid wasn't leaving when she told me yes the player was so you could see this happening. So I want to encourage all the listeners just notice notice how often throughout the day you're resisting the moment you're resisting yourself you're resisting your kid you're resisting traffic whatever it is and just take a moment pause shift to accepting it and doing something different where you're guiding yourself or guiding the kid like for any kind of successful diet it isn't about not eating bad things it's about choosing good things that you enjoy to eat. Everything tells you you're more likely to be successful at that. Yeah, I'm gonna wake up and eat a bunch of vegetables today. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm looking forward to that rather than I don't get to eat donuts today or I don't get to eat that. You're never gonna succeed that way. So teach the kids from the time they're little all the way through that it's not resisting you or resisting the moments, accepting what's happening and then choosing to guide it to where you want it to And with the leaving thing, it can be... Oh yeah, it's hard to leave. It's hard to stop playing. You kind of have that quick moment of empathy and oh, let's walk out backwards or spinning or being silly or oh, we're about to go see grandma and start talking about what you're going to do with grandma. Whatever it might be for you, help shift that child's brain while you're talking and putting on shoes or whatever. Their brain starts to shift into the next thing. It moves them in that direction and there's not that. pushback instead. It's like, oh, here we're flowing over here. I think a lot of parents think when you say that too, it seems like, oh, you're just distracting them. But it's like, no, you're shifting their attention. Yeah, you're you're you're getting attention. I know. You're shifting their attention towards something else. Their their attention is focused on what they're not getting. and we're gonna focus towards where we're going. We're just guiding. Just like I might not eat ice cream every night, instead I'm gonna have more fruit or more vegetables or I'm just shifting my, I'm not bribing my brain with veggies, I'm just shifting my focus where I'm wanting it to go. That's wonderful. So I hope you find these four specific steps very helpful to you to changing something that seems small, like kids saying stop it in their home, but also in a bigger way. really being able to understand how to effectively make change happen in your life. personally in your marriage, with your kids, with any area. It really is this fundamental belief that's at the core of it. So I hope you took some of those tips and really start practicing it today and start seeing some positive outcomes. Whatever, we'd love to hear your feedback on that. I'd to send some comments. If you want to reach out to us, you can reach out to me at Kyle Wester at parentinglegacy .com. You can reach out there. We'd love to hear the experience you're having. And also we'd love for you to share this podcast with your friends. rate it, give us five stars, review it. We love all that feedback. It really encourages us to hear about how this is helping other families. I don't think we've ever read one and been like, didn't want to hear that. You know, it's really nice because the time and effort we're putting into it's nice to know how it's going out into the world. And then we do love the comments because it helps us build what. where it's gonna go next. Yeah, and it's always fun to get a chance to connect with parents. And some parents have reached out to us and wanted coaching. And so that's something you look forward to. You can also reach out to us for that as well. So we hope you're having a wonderful day as you're listening to this and you have a great week ahead accepting the week as it is. We appreciate you. I'm going to do the intro. I think every parent has the experience of hearing, stop it, stop it, stop it happening in their home. And every parent knows what it's like to hear the kids fighting or the kids acting in ways you don't want. And the only thing that you can think to do is yell, stop it or quit it. Well, today we're going to dive into why that's not gonna change anything. And we're gonna give you four specific awesome steps that you can take today and change. the moment that you're experiencing with your family. It's gonna help raise kids who aren't resisting you and you aren't resisting them. It's gonna create so much more cooperation and flow for your family. So we look forward to diving into that subject with you today.