Episode 82

[Kyle]: On today's podcast we are going to help you help your kids make a better school year, by teaching you how to have these moments where you can become receptive to what's going on in their day and in their school day with their friends and all their activities. So, we're going to give you some practical steps how to do that today. Hope you enjoy it. 

[Kyle]: Hello, and welcome to episode 82 of The Art of Raising Humans. I’m Kyle.

[Sara]: And I’m Sara.

[Kyle]: And today we should be dropping this on Labor Day, okay?

[Sara]: Yeah

[Kyle]: So, first Monday of September, and there's a few little things we wanted to share with you guys. We've got a speaking event coming up at the end of September at a church called Anthem in Tulsa, Oklahoma and we actually just put a speaking page on our website. Pretty cool.

[Sara]: Yeah. Yeah, that's really cool.

[Kyle]: And it kind of shows all of the speaking we've been doing this past year and some speaking events we already have scheduled. So, what you'll notice on there, we don't go into great detail, but like this one at Anthem, for instance, we're going to do a three part series on parenting through the lens of faith, parenting with the knowledge of science and then the essential skills you need for parenting that way, you know ? And it's something that Sara and I really love talking about. It's a great foundational type course to do with churches or schools or whatever places want that and it can be fine-tuned, that language, to fit the environment. But if you're interested in something like that, we'd love for you to reach out to us, go to our website. You'll see on the speaking page, there will be a way to connect with us and contact us and tell us you're interested and so, man, we're excited to not only do it in Tulsa, but throughout the country. So, it would be great to do more and more stuff internationally or nationally. I know maybe we're dreaming big, but we'd love to help families wherever we can.

[Sara]: Yeah, we do.

[Kyle]: And so, that's something that's happening in the end of September. We also have some other events that we'll talk about in other recordings, but just wanted to share that one. If you're interested, go to the speaking page and see that there. We also want to ask you if you love these podcasts, they're helping you, please share them. Definitely comment or rate them. All those kind of things help more and more people to be able to see those things and we just want to make sure this is a free resource for any parents who are wanting to move away from fear and shame and to be able to better disciple their kids, to be self-disciplined, respectful human beings in this world and we'd really love for many people as possible have access to that. So, we don't want to just share that information ourselves.

[Kyle]: So today, Sara, I've picked this topic in particular because what I've noticed a lot in the practice as I've been helping kids and just typically around this time of year, around school. School has just started. It's been now for a lot of parents, a couple of weeks into school. There is a lot of times where kids are coming home and the school day is affecting them, you know? Sometimes it's just wearing them out, you know?

[Sara]: Yeah

[Kyle]: Some of them, they're coming home with a lot of baggage, a lot of negative events, even positive events, but they're definitely dysregulated and you can tell that by how they're all over the place. They're acting kind of wild and crazy and so, there is this new kind of rhythm that parents have to get into, a new dance where the kid comes home with this stuff. I just thought I really wanted to discuss this topic in particular to help equip parents to better handle those moments.

[Sara]: Yeah, I heard some parents talking about it at our daughter's soccer practice last week and just talking about, where you know as a parent, as school starting back up, that at least for a good couple of weeks it's going to be extra. Because every day they come home, I think some kids shut down, some kids really act out. I know-- I remember when we picked our daughter up, especially when she was younger, I just knew give it an hour or two and there was always going to be something, and the tears would flow, all the emotions, and it could be the smallest little thing, but I knew it was the stress of the day and so, I think where just like, we come home and sometimes-- You know, you might be that type of person just “let me turn on the TV and everyone be quiet” or “let me go--" Some people want to go for a run, you know?

[Kyle]: Yeah

[Sara]: But we all feel that we carry the stress of the day. Good, bad, doesn't even matter. But all of that, they've had to be on and functioning and focused and handling all this stuff coming at them for a very long time, and it’s stressful.

[Kyle]: Yeah, and so, what we've always tried to do in the podcast, Sara, is try to not just speak to how to help your kid, but also how to help yourself as a parent. Because I think everything you just said is true about us as parents.

[Sara]: Yes, yeah.

[Kyle]: As school starts up again, you know? Summer, there is a stress itself to the summer, but there's this other extra stress as working parents, as stay home parents, whatever. The rhythm, the routine has now changed and so, there are these ways that the parent is also extra stressed, and there's all these extra things going on inside of them as well.

[Sara]: Yes, we all have to adjust to the change of the schedule and the change of just all the extra.

[Kyle]: So, as I was thinking about ways in which we deal with this. I was thinking about Dr. Siegel's work on The Wheel of Awareness, okay? And for any of you who don't know Dr. Siegel is, he's a neuroscientist, you can go back to our first few episodes where we talk a lot about the brain and the research he's done on developing kids’ brain and we don't want to dive too much into the weeds with all that, because Dr. Siegel can definitely get into the weeds about all that stuff and we're not neuroscientist experts, and we don't even act like we are. So, what we do, though, is use some of his information, like The Wheel of Awareness, to help better understand what's happening in us and in our kids, so this time of year isn't just like “oh, grip really hard and get through it”. It's really about “how can we grow closer with our kids and better understand ourselves during this time?”. Because Sara, there's so many ways that I hear in practice where there's these stories going on at school, there's these stories going on during these times of year when it's really high pressure. All these things are changing that really are shaping and forming our kids and sometimes the parents aren't even aware of it, you know? Because the kids aren't even aware of it. I mean, the kids come home and some of these stories, they're not even thinking about them.

[Sara]: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

[Kyle]: Ways in which a teacher was mean to them or a kid said something very hurtful to them, and they just learn to just stuff it or just ignore it, and it comes out in all of this wild, crazy stuff and that may be they're just tired, it may be that they're hungry, but it also may be they're really hurting. You know, they're really confused and so, the more we can be intentional about helping them be aware of those things, then we have more power to guide that instead of that story taking a life of its own.

[Sara]: Right. Yeah.

[Kyle]: So, today I wanted to really discuss some quick things that you can do and once again, we're not going to go too deep, but I think you'll better understand this Wheel of Awareness and we'll include this on our social media stuff. So, if you're not connected to us on Facebook or Instagram, get there. We'll show the Wheel of Awareness. It's a really cool kind of idea of how to explain you being better aware of yourself and the kind of stories that are kind of guiding you in a moment and also your kid, and you'll have a better understanding about how to talk about each of those spokes with your kid.

[Kyle]: So, I wanted to give you a real quick way this dance can happen. So, I noticed this, Sara, with us just a few weeks ago. So, something we've asked our oldest daughter to do a lot is to come down. We'd like her to come down a little earlier than she comes down from her room and so, sometimes she spends some time up in her room and sometimes she's reading. She's like up there sometimes journaling or doing different things like that. But sometimes the school day becomes quite a rush if she's not down soon enough.

[Sara]: Yeah, you know, that morning schedule.

[Kyle]: And so, there is a stress that happens in you and I about that and we're like “okay, the other two are already up. We're getting breakfast, we're doing all this stuff and when is she going to come down so now we can do this thing?” and so, sometimes when she comes down, there's already this like, “oh, finally”, you know?

[Sara]: Yeah, yeah. “Kind of messing up our whole schedule here”.

[Kyle]: And lots of times we are kind of aware of that within ourselves, but other times we aren't. So, what this looks like, and I'm sure all the listeners can relate to this, is she'll come down. I remember this the other day, recently, she actually came down earlier than she normally comes down and I remember she said something about her shorts and these shorts that you had bought her and how she didn't necessarily like those shorts and you were kind of frustrated. You immediately were like “we just bought those shorts, for goodness sake. So, we bought them like, a month ago”.

[Sara]: Yeah, yeah, because it was one of those moments where we went out shopping and we spent all this time to get shorts that just fit and she loved and now, you're telling me 30 days later that you don't like them anymore or whatever.

[Kyle]: And I remember as you're talking, I'm like “yeah, yeah”. I'm thinking “yeah, that's right. Yeah, we did buy those” and I'm like, as soon as you were done like, “and the dishes last night, I thought you said you were going to take care of those dishes”. It was like--

[Sara]: “Just pile it on”.

[Kyle]: Oh, we’re like… We're just shooting left and right everything that we'd been kind of holding up that whole morning as she was waiting to come and at that time, I actually-- Even as much as we do this, I was thinking “yeah, yeah. That's right, Sara. We really gave it to her. She needs to get down here sooner to get this stuff done”.

[Sara]: Well, it’s just kind of this laundry list of “Hey. So…” You know, we went down this whole laundry list.

[Kyle]: And so, as I went throughout the day, Sara, I wasn't thinking about it much until I got to work and I start thinking about how to help other parents with their kids.

[Sara]: Yeah, and I think you sent me a text message, right? [Unintelligible]

[Kyle]: Yes, and I was thinking like “I think we really just gave it to her; you know? I don't know if that's going to encourage her…”

[Sara]: And we weren’t even super mad, but we were just kind of like “Hey, and this and this and this”. Yeah.

[Kyle]: Yeah, we were kind of critical, kind of nitpicking on things and I was thinking “is that going to help her come down sooner or continue to encourage her to stay in her room?”, right?

[Sara]: Yeah

[Kyle]: And that's kind of where it hit me, Sara, of just our lack of awareness that we were not being intentional. You know, Dr. Siegel talks about as you become more aware of yourself and what you're doing and these different spokes that he describes, then you can actually pay attention to that and then become intentional about what you're doing and how you're interacting with the kid. Because we had been saying to her, we wanted her to come down sooner, but then our very actions made it more difficult for her to want to come down sooner.

[Sara]: Yeah, we weren't very inviting.

[Kyle]: No, not at all and so, I actually called her before I started some sessions that day, and I just apologized to her, and I just said “Hey, Abby, I do want you to come down earlier and I know I didn't even greet you with a good morning. I didn't greet you with a hug. I didn't seem excited at all for you to come down” and then she said at that point, she didn't say it that morning, but she said “I know, I was coming down early. I just wanted to tell you guys about my shorts and how I didn't really like how they fit and whatever it was and then you guys just started coming at me” and I think I want to raise the awareness for a lot of parents how impactful that is and how much it causes damage later on, right? Because then you could see how if I'm Abby, I don't want to come down early anymore, then we complain about her not coming down early more and this is the dance, and each of us is not aware of how that dance is guiding the relationship and hurting it.

[Sara]: Right, right.

[Kyle]: So, once I became aware of it and I could call it out and kind of clarify to her that isn't my intent, it helps me change my intent, but also helps her better understand that intent too and so, an important piece, Sara, of this is obviously we've got to take time. We've got to take time to create some space, you know? So, I was thinking of this happened on my way to work. So, I was able to drive to work and think about it, rather than just be distracted by just listening to music or sports talk radio, whatever it might be that I'm used to listening to. I was actually able to think about this interaction, and in that space, I became more aware of it. Now, the problem for a lot of parents, Sara, is once school hit, it's like “go, go, go, go” and so, a lot of parents will talk to us about how they don't have that space, they don't have that time. Because it's like as soon as they come home, I need them to get dressed to go to soccer or to go to football or to go to lacrosse or to go to piano or whatever it might be, and it's just “go, go, go, go” until they go to sleep and by then, everyone's just exhausted. You just want the kid to go to bed. So, talk to me about the challenge of that, Sara. How does a parent or how do you do that? How do you create that space to be able to have some of these conversations to raise your awareness and theirs? Because I know your go from, you're homeschooling the kids all day, and it's just “go, go, go” from the time they get up.

[Sara]: It is “go, go, go”. Yeah. No, I think-- But my first reaction is “yeah, I don't have time for that”. I mean, it’s true, you do. You had the drive in the car--

[Kyle]: Yeah, I did need some space.

[Sara]: But I immediately dove into the next things and it's just all day till 9:30 at night, and everyone's finally getting somewhere, to bed or whatever. But I think you have to look for it and it has to be prioritized, which feels when I say it, I'm like “oh my god, man, another thing to prioritize”.

[Kyle]: Yeah

[Sara]: But I love that we can keep doing this dance, we can keep having these interactions if I don't change anything, and I can keep asking her to change. But the most powerful thing is for me to change and as parents, we hold a lot of power. Rather we sometimes we don't feel like it, but we really do; All the studies show it. Kids when they grow up, they look back and a lot of stories of people saying how much parents do hold power in their children's lives, and we're the makers of the voice in their head and all of that and so, if I think of that just like I want to feed my kids nutritious meals or help them get sleep or then this has to rise in my priority list of taking, even just a few minutes to be intentional about looking at these interactions and going “oh, what was going on there?”, and of course, we want strategies and we want to help our kids, but I love what you brought up earlier. It really needs to start with my Wheel of Awareness and the wheel, if no one's seen it, it's a wheel with spokes. It reminds me of like a bike, a bicycle wheel. You know, it's more like that with the different spokes and I have to really take even five minutes, anytime I can give to it to not let these moments stack on top of each other.

[Sara]: Because that's where you start to create a file in your mind and your child creates a file in their mind and you have a relationship file of “here's our cycle, here's what we do in our relationship” and the more you dig that groove deep and that file drawer gets filled up even more with these interactions, it's much harder to change it because if you ride that same path over and over again, it’s hard to-- You know, if you've done that with a bicycle, speaking of bike wheels, but it's really hard to ride outside of that, right? Your bike almost just naturally goes in that, and your relationship with your child naturally goes there. So, if I want that to change or I don't want to create that groove in that way, I need to be aware of myself and take that time and prioritize it and find five minutes, 20 minutes, whatever I can do, to journal, talk with somebody, think about it myself, but go through this awareness of figuring out what that dance is going on.

[Kyle]: Well, Sara, I think that's why we know the science behind meditation, the science behind mindfulness, the science behind exercise. So, I know a lot of listeners right now, you're doing some of these activities already and you continue doing them because it's helping you achieve what Dr. Siegel's talking about in the spoke, in that middle center of awareness, I know the thing I'm doing is helpful to me, Sara, because it leads to more awareness. I'm more open, I'm more peaceful, I'm more calm, I'm more receptive, and my thoughts are more clear, okay? They're not so jumbled, right? So, in these moments with the kids, with Abby in the morning, we weren't any of these things. We weren't open, we weren't peaceful, we weren't calm, right? So, what that tells me. So, the way I see it, Sara, and the way I help kind of parents in session is, Siegel's got these different spokes and just in short, you can see a picture on this on social media or look this up yourself. But he's got how we are driven, those spokes are by our perceptions of the moment, our memories. You hear this a lot from parents. Like “when I was a kid, we never could have done that”. These memories pop up our thoughts about it, our feelings, our dreams, and our body sensations, you know? And I know when you and I were talking before we did the podcast, that body sensations is one a lot of parents are aware of, you know?

[Sara]: Yes

[Kyle]: You know, like “I was really hungry, and that's why I was so frustrated”, right?

[Sara]: Yeah.

[Kyle]: Or “I was really hot”. I know heat is not something--

[Sara]: Yeah. So, if you start with those external ones, to me, hot. Well, maybe because we're in Oklahoma and it's really, really hot.

[Kyle]: Yeah, it’s like 105 now.

[Sara]: And you go outside and you're just sweaty and grumpy and hot, and it's really hard to feel great out there. So, that would be one thing. Maybe things are terrible because you're just miserable. That's one layer of it.

[Kyle]: Or if we're tired, or--

[Sara]: Yeah, that's that internal-- Yeah

[Kyle]: I think a lot of people are aware of like, “Maybe my thoughts. I'm overly stressed about work or anxious about this big thing”, right? So, I'm pointing out that a lot of us realize that in these moments, these are driving us to become a human that we don't necessarily want to be in this moment, okay? Like “I was extra stressed that day. That’s why I was so mad at my kids all day” or “I was extra hungry and I just need to get something to eat” or like, I purposely don't go-- Like, the kids are in Scouts, and I don't go camping in really hot weather because I'm not a nice person when I'm really hot, because actually, it reminds me of my childhood when we didn't have air conditioning for three summers, and it was just miserable. So, I know I am not going to be open, clear, receptive, calm. I'm just going to be frustrated and annoyed the whole time.

[Kyle]: So, I think in general, we as parents are aware to some extent about that, right? So, I'm wanting to help parents take that same level of awareness and go a little deeper, okay? So, an example I was thinking of, Sara, is when I just blew up recently about the kids came home, I'd bought some really good cookies, you know? You eat gluten free. We got these great gluten free cookies, and they're expensive and the dog also had a birthday going on at the same time. So, I also bought a bone for the dog. Now, long story short, you can kind of see where this is going, I ask--

[Sara]: We’re both sitting in bags on the countertop.

[Kyle]: And I asked the kids, the kids said “can we give the dog the bone?”; “Yes. Grab that bag” and I point to the wrong bag, and they end up giving the dog all the really expensive cookies and I was really mad, a lot madder than I had been in some time and even though there's a lot of things in that anger that I look back and of course, I could let shame come on me, and a lot of like “why did I get so upset?”. But what I'm trying to point out is through this exercise of being aware that that mad had nothing to do with the kids, that mad was about my own anger at myself for making that mistake and there was all these ways in which I've made mistakes. Like, through my memories throughout life that I'm mad at myself of all these mistakes and how I want other people, like you and the kids, to not let me make mistakes, to actually make it all go better.

[Kyle]: I so desperately wanted Brennan to have looked in that bag and seen it was not a bone, it was cookies and I was mad at him for not looking. I was mad at Ellie for this. But eventually, in sitting down with the kids and creating space, and this is what I'm talking about-- I hope the listeners can understand this. In creating that space, I believe that moment, although there was damage done through the repair and walking through this with the kids, and to say “Listen, here's what was happening inside of me. This is what caused me to get so upset, and I'm really sorry, because that was none of your deal. It was all me. It was all me” and then the kids were able to say “here's what it did in me” and we're able to have this discussion, and it's like we're walking through each spoke. You know, the thing it's very fluid. But the point is, in Siegel's work is to help us become more integrated and whole. Because if we're able to become more integrated and whole with the story, then the story isn't going to keep controlling us.

[Sara]: Yeah, that's the part I love, is that freedom that you feel, and you really start to feel it the more you do this and you can feel that integration happening and your children can too and it does a lot for your relationship to see it come together and go “oh, this is what was going on” and something inside of you. Our bodies are wired to need that, that complete circle. That where we come back and we see the injuries, the wounds, the stressors, whatever might be going on, and we bring it back around and that integration, helps our body actually start to release that stress instead of hang on to it. So, it impacts us tomorrow and the and the next day, next day and the next day and the next day. Now, I'm not saying you do it this one time and it's not ever going to come up again for you, but over time, it loses its strength and its impact in you because you've integrated that story, your body can now move on from.

[Kyle]: So, what I noticed, Sara, in that moment I wrote this down, I was not seeing the kids clearly, you know? And specifically, with Brennan because he had done the action. If you see what happens-- This is what happens, guys, with stories that are-- The story I had was I was so mad at myself for making a mistake and why didn't I make a different choice? And then what I did was basically turn all of that on Brennan and then Brennan is going to have this story “Why didn't I do something differently? Why did I make a mistake?” and if I'm not careful to discuss that with him, then Brennan will have the exact same reaction as he gets older and becomes a parent himself, you know?

[Sara]: Right, right.

[Kyle]: Because he'll say “there is no excuse for making a mistake. You should always beat yourself up as bad as you can when you make a mistake”, right? And so, Siegel has this quote that we've always stuck with. We don't always live it out, but it is always in the back of my mind is “children come to know who they are by the responses of the adults around them”. So, really that's what this is helping. If you're feeling like right now, school, these kids are coming home, they're wild, they're crazy, they're all-- And you're just reacting and reacting and reacting, that's what they're doing too and these moments, you got to understand that you're not seeing the kids clearly. What I mean is like, seeing them wholly. You know, you're seeing them as little pieces of the spokes, you know? There's aspects of those spokes on that wheel that are guiding your reactions. So, if I'm reacting instead of responding, instead of receiving the kid, then I need to go back and raise my awareness of what is driving that and, do I want my kids to come home and not see me clearly? Do I want them not to see themselves clearly? Because that's what happens. The kid hears some kind of negative thing like “you're stupid” or the kid has a thought like “that kid was faster at turning his work, so I must not be as smart as that kid” and those stories become the driving force that causes the anxiety in class, that causes them to be super stressed about taking that test and they really becomes the dominant narrative, because they can't see themselves clearly, you know?

[Sara]: Yeah, yeah.

[Kyle]: And through this Wheel of Awareness, you help yourself see yourself clearly and help that kid see themselves clearly, so they can better be the human being they want to be and you can become the human being you want to be.

[Kyle]: So, I want to give like, a real practical, step by step way. You're coming home. I'm seeing a lot of kids, Sara, who-- Kids I saw in the summer who they would come to the practice and they'd be all like, chill and cool, but now they're coming to me after school and they're like… They're all over the place, you know? And the parent will say “it's been a long day” and you can tell with the kid, the kid is like, just gone from school to see me, to go to soccer practice and you can tell the kid is tired and stressed and all over the place.

[Sara]: Yeah, it’s a lot. Yeah.

[Kyle]: So, I want us to equip them, just in short, kind of what you would do if you saw the kid-- One of our kids acting like that, acting in a way that isn't typical for them, right?

[Sara]: Yeah

[Kyle]: I mean, obviously they're definitely not at their best. They're definitely not in this place of being peaceful and calm and aware. How would you use this will of awareness to kind of help, in short, to kind of shift them from that?

[Sara]: Well, obviously with children, as they get older, then I would want to discuss that wheel with them. As they're younger, you have to kind of carry that wheel for them and you just go through the practical. Do they need a snack? Do they need something like that? Are they physically comfortable? You know, maybe-- And then creating some sort of little space maybe while you're riding in the car. They have some favorite music they like.

[Kyle]: Yeah, yeah.

[Sara]: Some kids might need to talk and some kids might not. We definitely have a daughter who she'll just kind of spill it all out and she does. She just needs that verbal-- Just “let me get everything out that just happened in my day” and she'll just go on and on and on and just let her do that, and then she feels better. You know, we have another kid who's more like “let me have some alone time”. Maybe things are quieter. You know, one of our children will not even want music on in the car. So, I just look for little ways because I can't make it all better right now. If we really do have to go to the next thing, and sometimes we do, then I look for little things of, you know, “Here's something to eat. Let's do a couple of things for each one of you”. Just tune into your children, “how can I help them?”. Some of them might need five minutes on the trampoline, but just look for something, those little things to help them get through. But then you do need to plan long term how can we do this.

[Kyle]: I love all that. I would say too, what I'd recommend is first, knowing this is going to happen. Be prepared for it.

[Sara]: Yeah, be okay with that.

[Kyle]: Yeah, be okay with that and be aware of yourself that you're in a good space, that you're picking them up or they're coming home and you're ready to be receptive, ready to receive them and then connect, connect, connect. Once you connect-- That's what I'm doing. When these kids come wild and crazy to a session with me, is I'm immediately just trying to work on connection. I'm just trying my best to connect with them and to help them feel safe and lots of times in the session, we might go right into sand and working on some sand stuff and the reason why I'm doing is because it's kind of low key. I'm not saying “hey, how was the day? Tell me about the day”. I'm not like, peppering questions.

[Sara]: Yeah

[Kyle]: I really just want to receive them, that they are communicating to me without their words through their body and those actions. But I also want to note as a parent “okay, maybe right now isn't the time to hear some of that stuff, but I want to be intentional tonight when they go to bed, that I do give them an opportunity to maybe work through some of this stuff” and so, I think Siegel does such a great job of just thinking of “man, I wonder how they perceived what happened today. I wonder how they felt about what happened today. I wonder what their thoughts were about that”. I mean, you're not literally going through a checklist and doing that, but you're thinking in your mind that these six spokes are important, you know?

[Sara]: Yeah

[Kyle]: Like “I wonder how tense they were today. I wonder how they felt that in their body” and as you do that, you're actually teaching the kid how to do this for the rest of their life. That they're not going to be just controlled and reactive to life circumstances or the people at their work or their boss or-- You're teaching them how to be more aware and intentional about how they engage everybody in this world and so, that's why these moments are important, because these moments when they're in elementary school, it seems like “yeah, just get through it”. No, these moments are when they're the most moldable and shapeable.

[Kyle]: So, I hope in this, I know it's a big topic, and I know we've tried to-- As listeners, I hope we tried to explain it as well as we could, but I really just want you to get a good picture of that these kids need you to help them tease out these stories and the only way you can do that is if you're in a receptive place, because you yourself are aware that that's what this moment is about. This moment is about you understanding them and them understanding themselves and through that process, you're teaching them some skills that can last them a lifetime.

[Kyle]: So, we will provide some resources. I definitely want to put this-- We'll put this on social media. I’ll definitely put this-- I want to try to put this like, seven step thing that Siegel has about how to get there for yourself as a parent. We can add some of that stuff to our social media or to this podcast. Maybe there'll be a link below, is what we'll try to do. So, if you want to dive in this further and really take more-- Really understand better how you can be this person that can, hand in hand, co-create these stories with your kids rather than letting the stories create themselves, we'll try to give those tools to you as much as possible.

[Kyle]: All right. So, I hope this was helpful today and once again, please share this with other people and man, I hope you're hanging in there during this beginning part of the year. It's Labor Day. This is a restful day. Hope this podcast is helping you think about being intentional for the rest of the school year and helping those kids to be able, whether it's negative or positive, to be able to have a different perception of the school year going ahead.

[Sara]: We appreciate you. Thank you for listening.